Judge of the Song Dynasty Chapter 595: The dispute between the three laws (nine)

When Lu Xiaosheng stood up, Fan Zhen immediately gave him an apologetic look, but Lu Xiaosheng looked at him in shame, sighed, and walked down the court slowly.

This Lu Xiaosheng is Fan Zhen's confidant and friend, he is very upright and has a high moral integrity throughout his life, so Fan Zhen was the first to send him up to testify, intending to use him to show their country gentleman's demeanor and reverse the bad influence caused by the morning.

But how could he know that the other party still found a loophole, and even made his old friend suffer.

In the eyes of the squires, this is really bad for morale.

However, Fan Zhen still had a confident and strategizing demeanor, without any panic.

Then it was the defense's turn to summon witnesses, and this time it was Lu Bangxing who was in charge. He directly summoned a squire named Xu Qingnian, who refused to testify in court this morning because of his physical condition .

But at noon, after some persuasion from Fan Zhen, he agreed to appear in court.

After all, he is one of the plaintiffs. As a plaintiff, if he is not willing to testify in court, it is too convincing.

When the old man came to the court, he was not as arrogant as Liang Youyi just now, he was sitting in a well-behaved manner, his aggrieved eyes were like a lamb waiting to be slaughtered.

These country gentry also have today? Lu Bangxing almost laughed out loud, stood up, and asked directly: "I heard that Mr. Xu opened a Jieku shop in the city, specializing in lending money."

Xu Qingnian nodded and said, "Yes."

Lu Bangxing asked again: "I wonder how much interest Mr. Xu's Xieku shop usually charges?"

"There are highs and lows."

After all, Xu Qingnian immediately added: "I admit that some of the interest rates are relatively high. If the conversion method used by the imperial court is used, some of them are more than doubled."

I admit it all, don't ask.

Lu Bangxing smiled slightly, and said again: "I don't know if the interest agreed by the patriarchal clan this time will restrict Mr. Xu's Xieku shop?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said: "It's not restrictive, because that regulation is only for my folks in Huaishu Township, and the Jieku shop is in the city, and the two sides have nothing to do with each other."

Lu Bangxing said: "That is to say, Mr. Xu will not adjust the interest of Jiekupu to one cent five."

Xu Qingnian said: "No."

Lu Bangxing asked again: "So, Mr. Xu didn't really support the one-fifth interest?"

Xu Qingnian said: "That's not true. I'm happy to do something for the villagers, and my Jieku shop in the city is just for business, as long as it doesn't violate the law."

Lu Bangxing looked down at the copywriting and said: "But according to my investigation, your Xu family loaned up to twice as much to the villagers during the famine period about five years ago, which was the most difficult period for the villagers. , even tripled the interest, and annexed the land of dozens of common people. At that time, Mr. Xu didn't seem to think of doing something for the common people?"

Xu Qingnian glanced at him, I'm already so honest, you still want to do this, it's really murderous, and immediately replied: "Many people did this at that time."

He doesn't usually talk like this, and like Liang Youyi, he is full of benevolence, righteousness and morality, but he knows that talking about it here will only make himself more embarrassed, so he simply abandons the cloak of Confucianism and directly talks about interests.

There were boos all over the courtyard.

"Silence! Silence!"

Zhang Fei immediately tapped the gavel, as if this was his only job.

After the people outside the courtyard calmed down, Lu Bangxing continued to ask: "I heard that the draft agreement on the interest rate was drawn up by Mr. Xu."

"Yes."

Xu Qingnian nodded slightly.

Lu Bangxing asked: "Why did you ask Mr. Xu to draft it?"

Xu Qingnian said: "Because my family opened Jiejie Kupu, so I know more about it."

Lu Bangxing asked again: "I heard that in the draft agreement, whoever violates this regulation will be deprived of his hometown?"

Xu Qingnian was stunned for a moment, and after hesitating for a moment, he replied: "In the original draft agreement, it was drafted like this, but it was deleted later."

Lu Bangxing said: "Why?"

Xu Qingnian said: "This is because the government ordered to prohibit it. We are worried that writing this way will violate the law."

Lu Bangxing asked: "But according to my investigation, the patriarchal law of your Huaishu Township stipulates that if a woman becomes pregnant before marriage, she will be deprived of her hometown. I don't know if it is?"

Xu Qingnian frowned and nodded: "Yes."

Lu Bangxing asked: "Is there any deletion now?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said, "That's not true."

Lu Bangxing asked: "So Mr. Xu is not afraid of violating the law?"

Xu Qingnian was silent.

Lu Bangxing waited for a while, then said: "Maybe because of this regulation, you are the big landlords and squires, so you only set the regulations, but not the punishment."

Xu Qingnian hurriedly said: "Of course not."

Lu Bangxing asked: "Then why is there no punishment?"

Xu Qingnian thought for a moment, and then said: "That's because this matter has not been settled in the end. After this lawsuit is over, we will consider the issue of punishment."

After Lu Bangxing listened, he asked again: "In other words, this regulation can be modified."

A flash of regret flashed in Xu Qingnian's eyes, and he wondered in his heart, are these Er Bi's brains turning so fast? One hole was blocked, and another hole came in, endlessly, I could only nod helplessly.

Lu Bangxing asked again: "Can the interest be modified?"

"I'm not sure about that." Xu Qingnian said awkwardly.

Lu Bangxing asked persistently: "Is there a rule in the patriarchal clan that the interest cannot be modified?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said, "That's not true."

"That's OK."

"Yes."

Lu Bangxing said: "I don't know if you amend this regulation, do you need to seek the consent of all the villagers?"

Xu Qingnian said truthfully: "It's not necessary. Generally speaking, the rules in the village are decided by the elders in the village."

Lu Bangxing said: "That is to say, as long as a few elders in the village nod, they can change the interest at will."

Xu Qingnian said embarrassingly: "The elders in the village will also consider the attitude of the villagers."

Lu Bangxing asked: "How do you think about it?"

"Uh."

Xu Qingnian said: "The elders in the village will still think about the villagers."

Lu Bangxing said: "That's all, no supervision?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head.

Lu Bangxing said: "If I say that after half a year or a year, the elders in the village think that the interest rate is inappropriate, so they can directly modify it, right?"

Xu Qingnian struggled for a moment, and finally nodded.

"I'm done asking."

Lu Bangxing sat down directly.

Xu Qingnian couldn't help but breathe a sigh of relief.

This is really lenient for confession and strict for resistance!

Fan Zhen stood up slowly and asked, "Mr. Xu, in this regulation, is there any restriction that the villagers can only borrow from the village and not from outsiders?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said, "No. We only agree that the villagers will lend money in the village, and the interest should not be higher than one cent five."

Fan Zhen nodded, and said again: "Just now, Mr. Xu said that he opened a warehouse store in the city for lending. I wonder how much interest is in your store?"

Xu Qingnian said: "This is not certain. There is an interest rate of one cent, five cents, or even higher. This is determined according to the customer's collateral and the length of the loan."

Fan Zhen asked, "Will the interest rate set at 1/5 in the village affect your business?"

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said: "No, because the interest of one cent and five cents is not the lowest. If you have very valuable collateral, one cent of the interest is still enough to borrow money, but if you have nothing , and no one will guarantee it for you, and you may not be able to borrow it in the village."

Fan Zhendao: "So even if the village sets a five-fifth interest rate, it can't be a monopoly."

Xu Qingnian shook his head and said, "Impossible. I have never seen any businessman who can monopolize this business at a low interest rate, unless it is the imperial court."

Fan Zhen asked, "How do you say that?"

Xu Qingnian said: "Take that Jiaozi as an example. Back then, Jiaozi was issued by our Xieku shop. However, due to poor management, some Xieku shops issued Jiaozi indiscriminately, causing some people to lose their money. Therefore, the imperial court set up a special Jiaozi service for the issuance of Jiaozi, and at the same time prohibited private Jieku shops from issuing Jiaozi, and soon Jiaozi was monopolized by the imperial court.”

Fan Zhen said: "This is a good thing."

Xu Qingnian said: "But the imperial court has issued more, so that recently the people have returned to copper and iron coins."

The people outside the courtyard began to whisper and whisper. Xu Qingnian did not lie. Jiaozi plummeted after it was issued in Shaanxi for a short time. The reason was that the imperial court used Jiaozi to pay military salaries, far exceeding the government's reserve funds. As a result, Jiaozi immediately depreciated.

Businessmen also have the phenomenon of spamming, but the scope is limited, and it is impossible to cause such a bad influence.

The reason is that if merchants send spam, the common people will come to their door to make trouble immediately, and it will be controlled soon, and the government will take action.

"Thank you!"

Fan Zhen nodded, and said to Zhang Fei, "I'm done with my questioning, and all my witnesses have appeared in court."

The implication is that I can begin my closing arguments now.

This surprised many people, because the scene still seemed to be 50-50.

Only Zhang Fei nodded slightly to express his understanding.

Li Min was surprised: "Does he think the winner has already been decided?"

Qiu Zhengwen asked: "Then shall we still ask?"

Li Min thought for a moment, then glanced at the copy, and said: "Actually, we have almost covered what we want to ask, and the remaining few witnesses can be asked or not."

Lu Bangxing said: "Then it's better not to ask. If we only ask, and we can't ask any new questions, it will offend many people."

After all, they are just pens, and what they get is money. If they are hurting each other and everyone is their own master, then it doesn't matter. But now that the other party has given up asking questions, they are still breaking the news to death and continue to expose the squire. On the ugly side, that would upset a lot of people.

Li Min nodded slightly.

At this time, Zhang Fei asked them again: "Are there any witnesses for the defense?"

Li Min immediately replied: "Not anymore."

As soon as he opened his mouth, all the officials and squires breathed a sigh of relief at the same time, it was over.

It's really terrible!

Zhang Fei nodded and said: "In that case, both of you should prepare for the closing statement later."

After a while, it came to the stage of closing arguments.

Fan Zhen stood up first, and said: "All the accusations made by the government about the fact that the patriarchal law agreed on interest in the countryside are actually groundless. Their only reason is that the two-point interest of the young crop law comes first, while the patriarchal law One minute and five breaths are behind, that's all, but this is obviously untenable.

Because the one-fifth interest rate abounded everywhere, it wasn't something the squires suddenly thought of.

As for the so-called monopoly technique, it is even more ridiculous, because it is impossible to achieve monopoly by agreeing on interest in the patriarchal clan. Facts have proved that no businessman or landlord can do this. It is the government that can achieve monopoly through prohibition.

And the reason why they want to prohibit the patriarchal law to agree on interest is to seek a monopoly and let more people borrow money from young crops. This has nothing to do with benefiting the people, but only with interests.

More importantly, the actions of these twenty-eight townships are not illegal, no matter what their original intentions are. In this case, if the imperial court decides that the government wins the case, it will cause very bad consequences, because then the government can seek money, prohibit more folk conventions, and monopolize all ways of making money, even if these actions are all legal , In addition, this is even more inconsistent with the legal principle of the rule of law. I'm done. "

Many people nodded frequently when they heard it, and they all showed worried expressions.

Zhang Fei just nodded expressionlessly, then looked at Li Min again, "The defense can start the closing statement."

"Thank you."

Li Min stood up, "First of all, I want to explain that the government has the absolute right to prohibit the gentry from agreeing on low interest rates based on the patriarchal law, and the other side did not dare to question this just now."

Fan Zhen did not make a sound.

I dare not!

From a legal point of view, it cannot be disputed. Now that the emperor is a centralized system, the government certainly has the right to do so.

He sued that officials were arrogating their powers, accumulating illegally, and amassing wealth, but he didn't say that the government had no right to do so.

Li Min continued: "However, the government did not ban them violently, but sent people to communicate with them in advance. When the communication failed, they were forced to order the ban, and the reason for the ban was also It is not for the purpose of accumulating wealth, but for the sake of the people, not for profit with the people.

The reason why the imperial court promulgated the Young Crop Law was entirely because of the flood of private usury, which made the people miserable. Most of the private usury comes from these gentry and big landlords. They wantonly annexed the people's land with usury, exploited the people, and even forced the people to leave their hometowns, beg along the way, or turn into bandits, which had a very bad impact on the stability of the country.

This is obviously unfair. If they really care about the people, what were they doing before? It is precisely because the imperial court's patience with them is gradually disappearing that it is determined to promulgate the Young Crop Law to curb their actions.

Obviously they also know that the Green Crop Law will delay their intention of annexing the land, so they came up with this strategy to destroy the Green Crop Law, so I implore the chief judge to rule in our favor. "

A lot of people nodded frequently, thinking that what Li Min said made sense.

Is it because of the flood of usury that the court promulgated the Young Crop Law?

In an instant, all eyes were on Zhang Fei.

At this point in the lawsuit, there are not many people present. It can be seen who has the upper hand in the scene. They are not good people anyway. All are right.

Zhang Fei nodded, looked down at the copywriting, and then said: "The debate between the two parties just now revolves around the harm caused by usury to the country and the people, and they both hope that the people can live better, and they both say that It is very reasonable, so the president of the court believes that the common people have more say in this matter."

Speaking of which, he looked at the judging assistant's seat, and saw that the twenty judging assistants, like the common people outside, seemed extremely frustrated, but he still asked: "Judging assistants, now Do you have an answer in your heart?"

I saw them nodding for a while, shaking their heads for a while, their faces were very confused.

They are all bad guys, who the **** should I choose?

After Zhang Fei saw it, he said again: "This case is related to the interests of everyone in Hezhong Mansion. The chief judge also hopes that you can consider it carefully, so the chief judge will give you some time to think about it."

"Thank you, President."

At this time, the assistant judges seemed to have lost their initial excitement and excitement, and only had infinite pressure.

Zhang Fei picked up a cup of tea, took a sip, suddenly leaned forward, and whispered: "Who do you four think will win the case?"

Cai Biandao: "Students think that what the government said is more reasonable. After all, the government is thinking about the overall situation, while those gentry are only looking out for their own self-interest."

Shangguan Jun said: "The imperial court is looking at the evidence, not the overall situation. Obviously, what they did is not illegal."

Zhang Fei shook his head and sighed, "You guys! You are really not professional at all. Even now, you are still unable to give an accurate judgment."

The four of them couldn't help but looked at each other in blank dismay.

Is the outcome already decided?

No way!

Zhang Fei didn't seem to bother to talk to them anymore, leaned back, picked up some evidence they had just handed over, and began to examine it.

After a good while, Zhang Fei raised his head and asked the assistant judge again: "Have you thought clearly?"

The twenty assistant judges nodded at the same time, but there was still some hesitation on their faces.

Zhang Fei said: "If you think Ershibaxiang should win the case, please raise your hand."

The butcher was the first to raise his hand, and someone else raised his hand, three, four, five!

Eventually all hands up.

This scene really surprised many people.

Because in their view, the scene is 50-50, both sides have a lot of black material, and the people are booing on both sides, but they never thought that this vote would all fall to the plaintiff.

This?

Are they bought?

Yuan Jiang, who knew the truth, was a little hesitant at this moment. He never thought that under such circumstances, the common people would choose to trust the squires instead of the government without hesitation.

The squires are very relieved, after all, the people still trust them more.

Li Min, Qiu Zhengwen, Lu Bangxing almost stared out their eyes, what did I do wrong, you want to treat me like this? They are so bad, you still choose them, are you crazy?

Only Fan Zhen and Su Zhe smiled, as if everything was expected.

Zhang Fei also asked: "Can you tell me the reason?"

An old woman summoned up her courage and said, "I don't want to support the plaintiff, but I'm more afraid that I will have to go to the government to borrow money in the future."

It really sums it up in one word.

Most people outside the courtyard also nodded.

The money owed to the landlord can be dragged on, at most it will be punished, and everyone can still talk about it. Before the imperial court handled so many usury cases, the two parties finally reached a settlement.

You owe money to the government, you try it?

It must be bankrupt.

It's not that the officials want to kill the people on purpose, but because the money is not from the officials, but from the court. If the money is less, they can't do business, so they must make up for it themselves, which is naturally a point No less!

Isn't the Yaqian service a blood-like lesson, if there is a slight omission in the Yaqian service, and if the property of the public is wasted, the family will be penalized immediately, anyway, it is only a lot.

There is a saying, the lesser of these two evils.

Although the common people have not read the book, they know better than anyone which method hurts more.

As far as benefits are concerned, it's not a bad thing to have an extra one-five interest rate!

"I see."

Zhang Fei smiled and nodded, then whispered to the four people: "You are ashamed or not, the common people understand better than you."

The four little King Kong bowed their heads and focused on the evidence, pretending not to hear it.

Zhang Fei looked around again, and said in a loud voice: "The assistant judge has given his own judgment just now, and the chief judge will try the lawsuit from the judicial level.

First of all, the township agrees on interest based on the patriarchal law, which is far lower than the maximum interest stipulated by the law, and there is no coercive behavior, so there is no illegal behavior in it.

Secondly, the evidence presented by the prosecution is sufficient to prove that the prohibition of patriarchal clan agreement on interest will directly benefit the government, and even achieve the effect of monopoly. The defense did not provide strong evidence that they did so with the intention of undermining the green crop law.

Although the defense produced a lot of evidence to prove that many of the plaintiffs were duplicity, that they had previously benefited from usury, and that they were all sanctimonious hypocrites, but in the judiciary, character is the evidence It is not counted, and to benefit with legitimate interest, no matter what their purpose is, this will be guaranteed by the judiciary.

The defense spends a lot of energy trying to prove that the other party is all bad guys, but as far as the judiciary is concerned, bad guys don't mean guilt. "

Bad guy doesn't mean guilty?

Cai Bian and the others couldn't help but fell into deep thought.

Li Min and the others looked at Zhang Fei in embarrassment and bewilderment. They felt that what they said made sense, but they also felt it was weird.

See also Zhang Fei and continued: "Among them, what the chief judge values ​​most is the monopoly technique mentioned by the defense, because Emperor Zhenzong and Emperor Renzong have issued edicts prohibiting similar acts.

This kind of behavior will indeed cause harm to the country and the people, but the defense did not produce enough evidence to prove it. It is almost impossible to monopolize and manipulate interest.

Because not to mention five cents, it is one cent interest, which can make a lot of money, and everyone can borrow money, there is no threshold, so it is impossible to achieve monopoly. Taking a step back, even if they are really aiming at the Youth Law, it is only a reasonable competition, not an act of destruction. "

Everyone nodded frequently.

Lu Bangxing said: "Is this monopoly technique the key to our victory?"

Qiu Zhengwen said: "Isn't the highest principle of the rule of law the interests of the country and the monarch?"

Li Min said depressedly: "You don't want to talk about it."

"Me."

Qiu Zhengwen smiled awkwardly.

I heard Zhang Fei continue to say: "As for the concerns of the government, they think that the squires will use the patriarchal system to exploit the people. In fact, there is no need to worry too much, because if the interests of the villagers are harmed by the patriarchal system, they can come to the imperial court. For those who appeal, the patriarchal clan system in the village is just a kind of agreement, not a government order or decree, and the two parties in the agreement are in an equal relationship, not in a relationship of obedience.

Finally, the president of the court also fully understands the government, because government lending is different from that of the private sector, and interests cannot be determined arbitrarily, and decisions must be made through continuous deliberation, but this is in a disadvantageous position in commercial competition. Therefore, it is completely understandable that the government thinks that the interest agreed in the countryside will undermine the implementation of the Young Crops Law.

However, the government's approach is obviously unreasonable. The government should optimize its young crop law to make the green crop law more competitive, instead of prohibiting other people's legal competition in order to make their own business more competitive. Easy to do, this is obviously not a normal behavior, and the consequences are very serious. The previous salt administration has fully demonstrated this point. After the government monopolized everything, the situation only became worse, and finally the trade law must be implemented.

This will be detrimental to the commercial development of our country, and will inevitably lead to a reduction in commercial taxes, which will damage the interests of the country. At the same time, it will also violate the law of the ancestors. Inhibition, see any well thought out.

Based on all these, the president hereby judges that the government's ban is invalid. "

"Good!"

"Good verdict!"

"The chief judge is too right."

There were bursts of applause outside the courtyard, and gradually, it became a little hysterical.

This is also the only applause from the common people in this lawsuit.

They were almost depressed, even desperate!

This caused them to involuntarily pin their hopes on the imperial court, and what Zhang Fei said not only fully considered the rights and interests of the people, but the key point was that he agreed with the suggestion of the assistant jury. It's them, which makes them feel like rain comes after a long drought.